Re: ASW forum has become a barrel of FAIL

[Tomte]

Guys, I don't want to be a traitor, but I'm currently having a very civilised discussion with mrxak. He certainly gave me things to think about, and I guess he's right on most accounts.

At Redline, we are a very closed community. We're polite to ourselves, we think all is good. Sometimes we ridicule each other (against board rules), we think we developed the game (no, just the add-ons), that we own the place.
Truth is, we're just free tenants on the ASW webboard. There are some rules to follow in their house. In the Redline subforum we should be only talking about the game. Not general car related stuff, not how sorry we feel, that a certain board member has left us. Not that the design of the webboard doesn't please us. Not that wenhave a gripe how Ambrosia runs their shop, their house, their webboard. There is a place for all that in specific sub-forums, in PMs and emails.
The "what car do you have" is actually offtopic (and I posted in it as most of you did). We already got that one for free from the mods.

The topic that got locked was off-topic. Hamster pointed out just that, apparently in a not very clear manner. But if we had he forum rules on our mind while reading through it, we should have known from the off that wheelys tread, despite being very nice, was just not in the right place.

In my opinion, we should remember that we are guests at ASW, it costs them money to run it (ask Leo how much he pays for this place), that the mods do this work voluntarily and that they get chosen by ASW because they are known to impartial and also that they have a life beside the boards. Do we have a life beside Redline? I certainly didn't when I was still very active.

[Mackilroy]

Thanks for being reasonable, Tomte.

And hello everyone else.

djimpley: not a chance alphonse will become a moderator. You might (and I emphasize MIGHT) get one or two new mods, but it won't be anyone who doesn't already hold moderator status.

20FingerS: you should also share the other side of the story about how you called TwoJacks an idiot and that you were going to find him in real life and then bash him in the face. If you're going to be balanced, you can't hide your own fault while pointing fingers at someone else.

As far as 'encouraging other boards to spam you,' no moderator at ASW has done anything of the sort. I myself personally asked Buzzzzy, TwoJacks, and adam_0 to stop egging you on multiple times.

DonaemouS: it's not about power. It never has been. If power is the reason you're a moderator, then you should step down.

The reason mrxak thinks you're xenophobic is because of how you close ranks in the face of a threat, imagined or otherwise. I made a joke and you all flamed me for it. That isn't the mark of a welcoming community that allows free talk.

Personally, I would suggest posting in some of the other forums and meeting new people, but you're all more than welcome to continue in your own little community if that's what you prefer. But that's just me.

Have a good night.

[Tomte]

Mackilroy, welcome to our forum. Thanks for your comments and clarifications here.

[Mackilroy]

Thanks for the welcome. I'll do my best not to overstep the bounds you guys have in place here.

[Tomte]

We have bounds here?

[DonaemouS]

well, they had what they searching. We had people insulting us freely. Noone get banned. One posting a crap on welcome toad thread. No ban. One insulting all around the world. No ban.

But what they want was ban one of the Redline community to jump here in there inside their grey homes and share their "power" with friends. As I wrote. I don't need to be banned, I quit before. I don't usually give more then the normal fun to those small nerds.

I'm with you, 20, and I suppose you just wrote what you were thinking (I don't read and follow that thread, it doesn't deserve my read clicks and time).

I suppose your life is not changed after this "BIG BAN". To be honest, you gained more respect by me

[C.P. Frost]

Sigh. I should've gotten caught up before taking action. Considering I didn't realize the frenetic pace of most webboards had taken over, I don't feel bad about my decision-making in retrospect. I think a ban awaits, but screw it.

I guess I'll just join you guys in hanging out over here more now, eh?

@Mackilroy: sorry in advance for my posts. Well, not for the least-civilized one, awkwardly enough. Truth is, presumputous donkeys like adam know relatively little about our network just as we know relatively little about theirs, so a reality check was in order.

Le sigh.

[djpimley]

At Redline, we are a very closed community.

Respectfully, Tomte, I disagree. We are a small community but in no way closed to polite and friendly outsiders. We do not have a "Redline banter & brawl" as EV has, because the mods would not grant it, so it seems reasonable that they should be more relaxed about off-topics in the Redline forum than in EV with its 8 sub-forums. Ah, but here I am writing about reasonableness, when the crux of the problem is exactly as I wrote earlier in this topic.

The wider ASW forum community is a typical bunch of snarky snipers, as can be found on forums all over the web. Because this kind of offensive banter is their only way of communicating with each other online, they literally are unable to understand the difference between showing up in a random topic and writing "Hi there!" vs. "Hey idiots!"

The reason mrxak thinks you're xenophobic is because of how you close ranks in the face of a threat

And what else would you expect a group of friends to do?

Thank you, Mackilroy, for sharing your thoughts with us here. You will not be provoked or ridiculed by us just because you are not part of our clique, that is our only boundary for behaviour.

[djpimley]

Boycotting them means no Redline - they run the tracker

Anyone ever tried a direct IP game?

[DonaemouS]

DonaemouS: it's not about power. It never has been. If power is the reason you're a moderator, then you should step down.

The reason mrxak thinks you're xenophobic is because of how you close ranks in the face of a threat, imagined or otherwise. I made a joke and you all flamed me for it. That isn't the mark of a welcoming community that allows free talk.

Personally, I would suggest posting in some of the other forums and meeting new people, but you're all more than welcome to continue in your own little community if that's what you prefer. But that's just me.

Have a good night.

Welcome Mackilroy, as I wrote, almost all moderators are. Also, I can't realize, how people that doesn't even know me out of a forum, or a game, or whatever, can permit to call "me", or better, the rest of the writers, xenophobic. Mackilroy, are we fouls? But is that guy EVEN know what this word say?

Also, I don't have no reports if a guy join Redline or not, and this will lead to me to think why I would kick him off, or pushing in the black dark corner of the room (usually my favorite place, when I attack Tomte, and hide).

Since I first connected to internet, I meet people from EVERY side of the world, trying to understand their skills/cultures/way of doing things. I was even arranged to meet each others. From Germany, Yugoslavia, Croatia, I even invited Leo here in Rome.

No, I'm not xenophobic and NOONE would permit to call me with these kind of worlds. Now, returning to the game. Yes, Redline has an élite group, that was grown with the years. Is called "frendly", but is open to all new comers, without taking care the religion/color of skin/other games played. Mackilroy, download your cars, and come play online with us. For sure, you will understand what I mean better, then my english words.

As the last note. It remember me the time of Quake3 vs Unreal Tournament times. Leo should know what I mean. Both community always started flames and offense each other, with IRC channels takeover, ban on forums, and kicks from channels.

I always played both game and lived in the middle of both communities. My clan had 3 sections at the time, Quake/UT/Rainbox Six (aka Pros/WithoutSkills/Campers).

[djpimley]

usually my favorite place, when I attack Tomte, and hide

[Valentin K]

Boycotting them means no Redline - they run the tracker

Anyone ever tried a direct IP game?

Direct IP is painful, but has worked in the past when the tracker was down for maintenance. It's no solution for everyday racing.
Furthermore... what about the HoF?

[DonaemouS]

report:

a nerd who had nothing to do in that day, someone like this:



started to randomly offend other people in the Redline section. I sent a note to admin, to lock or remove the thread, without success. The nerd (look picture above), continued to insult people and those people, reacting in a way or another, defending their opinion, get banned. But, let's read who was banned.

20 Fingers (redline community)
C.P. Frost (redline community)
Pastrl (redline saint community)

PASTRL?!?!?!?!?!

YOU ARE MY GOD!!!

[djpimley]

Furthermore... what about the HoF?

Well, the HoF is small potatoes to me, perhaps because I'm not in it as much as you are.

[djpimley]

a reality check was in order

I read your post before it disappeared. Thanks for leaping to my defence! But it's ok. I just got back from a nice bit of trail riding, and I can tell you there's nothing like spraying some mud around, scaring the ducks, and a nice endorphin high to dispel the existential angst. I suggest y'all do whatever brings you joy for a few hours and make the trolls contemplate the sound of one hand clapping.

[Mackilroy]

mrxak has handed out a few more bans and locked another topic. This one, actually.

[20FingerS]

we should just avoid that forum for ever. We have a nice one here, which I didn't know...
I am asking mrxak if they have banned the idiots who attacked and started that war, still no answer.
But I think the mods have insulted us too much..."I know, the Redline People are xenophobic unless you are a hardcore sim racer"
I'd say let's boycott them and their webboard.

Boycotting them means no Redline - they run the tracker. The only problem are the crackbrained moderators. They are the same silly unworldly kids like these spam idiots. I have no idea why Ambrosia gave them this job. Probably because these are their main customers ...

Are we really forced to post on their board to keep playing a game that we PAID?

20FingerS: you should also share the other side of the story about how you called TwoJacks an idiot and that you were going to find him in real life and then bash him in the face. If you're going to be balanced, you can't hide your own fault while pointing fingers at someone else.

That was a PM to him, I wonder how you got this in your hands...if I didn't say that it's just because I didn't want to show off with my fellows here...but you "ruined" it...

I'm with you, 20, and I suppose you just wrote what you were thinking (I don't read and follow that thread, it doesn't deserve my read clicks and time).
I suppose your life is not changed after this "BIG BAN". To be honest, you gained more respect by me

Thanks Don, I appreciate your support. In these days I am struggling to filter my thoughts....
I said I wanted to bash 2 people faces off, but no worries, I won't search their address...

[Buzzzy]

I said I wanted to bash 2 people faces off, but no worries, I won't search their address...

I don't really want to discuss anything here, but can we please refrain from such violent ideas? I mean, in the end, Redline’s just a game, the forums are just forums on the internet…none of this really matters.

[DonaemouS]

I don't need, at 35 years old, a fail nerd that nothing has in his life, except the power provided behind a forum by someone using them freely to avoid waste money. I will continue to work on the RS6 but it will never published on Ambrosia made of nerd forum.

I got an unexpected pvt from buzzzy. I read it, and I tried to translate in something that was understandable by me. Buzzzy, I'm not used to publish the content of PVT, otherwise... why we call them PVT?

And also, I don't have the confidence to do that. I don't reading and posting on the asw after the offense I personally got, and I already wrote to Mackilroy my reasons. Is like, Valentin K helped me, this quoted phrase is where certain people are crying on.

Full of hateful... hateful.... But what hateful mean in english? Let's see:

hateful |ˈhātfəl|
adjective
arousing, deserving of, or filled with hatred : hateful letters of abuse that had come unsigned.

ummmh... no... you can do better. It's an opinion, my opinion, especially after I see and read the posts and messages in a bunch oh hours, wrote by people that I never seen before, and they are already able to judge me...

"made" Is not BUILT. But is much more like attended. English is not my first language, and in our "tongue" we say "made". Ambrosia Stuffs (real employers) are out of all. It's obviously...

[Tuktuk]

[...]
At Redline, we are a very closed community. We're polite to ourselves, we think all is good. Sometimes we ridicule each other (against board rules), we think we developed the game (no, just the add-ons), that we own the place.
Truth is, we're just free tenants on the ASW webboard. There are some rules to follow in their house. In the Redline subforum we should be only talking about the game. Not general car related stuff, not how sorry we feel, that a certain board member has left us. Not that the design of the webboard doesn't please us. Not that wenhave a gripe how Ambrosia runs their shop, their house, their webboard. There is a place for all that in specific sub-forums, in PMs and emails.
The "what car do you have" is actually offtopic (and I posted in it as most of you did). We already got that one for free from the mods.

The topic that got locked was off-topic. Hamster pointed out just that, apparently in a not very clear manner. But if we had he forum rules on our mind while reading through it, we should have known from the off that wheelys tread, despite being very nice, was just not in the right place.

In my opinion, we should remember that we are guests at ASW, it costs them money to run it (ask Leo how much he pays for this place), that the mods do this work voluntarily and that they get chosen by ASW because they are known to impartial and also that they have a life beside the boards. Do we have a life beside Redline? I certainly didn't when I was still very active.

You are so wrong Tomte. We are a small community there, but open minded to everyone. We are polite to everybody, but not to spammers and insulting people.

Things are so easy: Not offtopic threads make problems but spammers and agitators and - at least - moderators which don't understand this.



Mackilroy, maybe you speak like a real moderator but - as you mentioned on ASW - you have no power to trash or lock spam threads. Would you do it if you could?
These spam thread over there should have been removed (or at least locked) immediately - not honest people (for a few days). That would have been an effective cleaning.

The moderator there with "power to lock" (and trash?) came too late and made everything wrong after - acting like a bad programmed software inside a computer with short times overloads.

Are we really forced to post on their board to keep playing a game that we PAID?

No. I meant boycotting ASW themself makes no sense because you was speaking about boycotting them AND the board - which included ASW as well ;-)

[Buzzzy]

You are so wrong Tomte. We are a small community there, but open minded to everyone. We are polite to everybody, but not to spammers and insulting people.

Things are so easy: Not offtopic threads make problems but spammers and agitators and - at least - moderators which don't understand this.

As I said before, I want to put this to rest instead of arguing, but why do you equate spammers with insulting people and agitators? mrxak left the spam topic open because mindless spam is completely harmless, this is an entirely separate issue from flamewars.

[DonaemouS]

As I said before, I want to put this to rest instead of arguing, but why do you equate spammers with insulting people and agitators? mrxak left the spam topic open because mindless spam is completely harmless, this is an entirely separate issue from flamewars.

Emmmmh, eniosam get banned from ASW forum cause started a thread that someone THOUGHT was a spam thread!!! You know what I mean?!? BANNED!

Was just a smile...

And now they leave a spam topic, started by a friend, cause was offending? And what about the flame? I immediately reported the topic before the flame. But they waited to ban redline community members, and cause wasn't enough, offended the rest...

[C.P. Frost]

I said I wanted to bash 2 people faces off, but no worries, I won't search their address...

I don't really want to discuss anything here, but can we please refrain from such violent ideas? I mean, in the end, Redline’s just a game, the forums are just forums on the internet…none of this really matters.

You said it perfectly. That is, you've precisely voiced the mindset that gave rise to this whole affair. Banter-based forums often rely on their anonymity and stand-alone properties when determining their modus operandi. They're a place where one can blow off steam. But the people who play this game regularly, who contribute to it, who put their backs into it, view this more the way you'd view getting together for a track day with some friends in real life. Most of us know each other as people as we exist in the real world, behind the digital curtain. Our mannerisms are built accordingly. So it's not so much that we're closed-minded, it's that we have a set of protocols which are starkly at odds with those of the rest of the forums (and much of the rest of the internet).

That means that when folks who aren't aware of how things are run around here venture in, they're likely to stir up trouble. People who call us xenophobic are missing the point: it's like a bunch of graffiti-artist frat boys running around a neighborhood joyously trashing things, then when we come out of our houses to protest (admittedly, some of us already brandishing shotguns), calling us sticks in the mud. We're not living in the same social space as they are, and we're not going to wait around for them to quiet down so we can have a conversation.

TL;DR: we don't view this as a meaningless space with no accountability, so people who come here with that attitude are going to get some shit. And that's not actually wrong... though it's true that 20 feels bad for freaking them out.

[Buzzzy]

I said I wanted to bash 2 people faces off, but no worries, I won't search their address...

I don't really want to discuss anything here, but can we please refrain from such violent ideas? I mean, in the end, Redline’s just a game, the forums are just forums on the internet…none of this really matters.

You said it perfectly. That is, you've precisely voiced the mindset that gave rise to this whole affair. Banter-based forums often rely on their anonymity and stand-alone properties when determining their modus operandi. They're a place where one can blow off steam. But the people who play this game regularly, who contribute to it, who put their backs into it, view this more the way you'd view getting together for a track day with some friends in real life. Most of us know each other as people as we exist in the real world, behind the digital curtain. Our mannerisms are built accordingly. So it's not so much that we're closed-minded, it's that we have a set of protocols which are starkly at odds with those of the rest of the forums (and much of the rest of the internet).

That means that when folks who aren't aware of how things are run around here venture in, they're likely to stir up trouble. People who call us xenophobic are missing the point: it's like a bunch of graffiti-artist frat boys running around a neighborhood joyously trashing things, then when we come out of our houses to protest (admittedly, some of us already brandishing shotguns), calling us sticks in the mud. We're not living in the same social space as they are, and we're not going to wait around for them to quiet down so we can have a conversation.

TL;DR: we don't view this as a meaningless space with no accountability, so people who come here with that attitude are going to get some shit. And that's not actually wrong... though it's true that 20 feels bad for freaking them out.

Um, no, that’s not what I meant. I was suggesting to stop spreading negative feelings, and drop it.

I’d also like to clarify some things. I read the B&B, but I’ve never posted there. I’m not really part of either crowd entirely. Secondly, you assume that the B&B relies on anonymity without verifying this.

Members of this forum have, with some frequency, met each other in real life, and know each other's real names.

Read the whole thing here.

Please, it does nobody any good to spread negative feelings about anyone. That said, I’d like to be frankly honest about one statement you made:

We're not living in the same social space as they are, and we're not going to wait around for them to quiet down so we can have a conversation.

This is like the definition of xenophobia. The Redline forum isn’t a membership club, anyone on Ambrosia Forums can post in it. Especially seeing as you don’t have moderator privileges, you are obligated to respect other social behaviors. If someone wants to be loud and rowdy and can still contribute to the community, so be it. It’s not your say to exclude them.

About eniosam, that was a really long time ago. Let’s please not dwell on the events of the past. What do you get by spreading negative feelings anyway?

[Tuktuk]

[[...]
As I said before, I want to put this to rest instead of arguing, but why do you equate spammers with insulting people and agitators? mrxak left the spam topic open because mindless spam is completely harmless, this is an entirely separate issue from flamewars.

Because its all the same - at least.

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